Dr. Jeff Masters' WunderBlog

Heavy rains hit Florida coast; Jova and Irwin a threat to Mexico
Posted by: Dr. Jeff Masters, 1:01 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011 +21
A large low pressure system with heavy rain is developing this morning over Cuba, South Florida, and the Bahamas. The counter-clockwise flow around this low is bringing strong winds and heavy rains to much of the Florida coast. Radar-estimated rainfall amounts are already in excess of four inches along a stretch of Florida coast from West Palm Beach to Daytona Beach. Much of the region, including Cocoa Beach, is under a flood watch, high surf advisories, and a high wind watch for wind gusts of 45 - 55 mph. These these conditions will spread northwards to Georgia by Sunday, and South Carolina by Monday. I doubt that this storm will acquire enough organization to evolve into a subtropical storm that gets a name, based on the latest model output, and the fact that the storm's center may well be over the state of Florida. NHC is currently giving this storm a 20% chance of becoming a named tropical or subtropical storm by Monday morning. This is a large, diffuse system that will bring strong winds and heavy rains to a large area of the Southeast U.S. coast, regardless of the exact center location. Since the storm is going to get its start as a cold-cored upper-level low pressure system with some dry air aloft, it will not be able to intensify quickly.


Figure 1. Radar-estimated rainfall from the Melbourne, Florida radar as of Saturday morning.


Figure 2. Rainfall forecast for the 5-day period ending at 8 am EDT Thursday, October 12, 2011. The storm system affecting Florida this weekend is expected to bring up to 7 inches of rain along the coast. Heavy rains associated with a strong trough of low pressure are also expected to dump 4 - 6 inches of rain over drought-stricken areas of Texas, Oklahoma, and Kansas. Image credit: NOAA/HPC.


Heavy rain event coming for drought-stricken regions of Texas, Oklahoma, and Kansas
A strong low pressure system is expected to track across the Texas and Oklahoma Panhandles this weekend, bringing the heaviest rains of the year to drought-stricken portions of Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas, including Abilene, where a flash flood watch is posted today. Rainfall in this region has been 13 - 20 inches below normal for the year; Lubbock, Texas has had just 3 inches of rain this year, compared to a normal of 16 inches. Rainfall amount of 1 - 4 inches will be common in the region over the weekend, and may be able to reduce drought conditions from the highest level (exceptional) to the second highest level (extreme.) However, the heaviest rains will stay confined to the western half of Texas, and Texas's major cities such as Houston will see very little rain over the weekend.


Figure 3. Visible satellite image of Hurricane Irwin and Tropical Storm Jova yesterday afternoon over the East Pacific.

Jova and Irwin: trouble for Mexico's Eastern Pacific coast
In the Eastern Pacific off the coast of Mexico, Tropical Storm Jova continues to slowly intensify. Jova will turn north and then northeast over the weekend as a strong trough of low pressure dives southward over northern Mexico. The computer models have come into better agreement on the track of Jova, with the region of coast centered on Manzanillo at greatest risk of a strike. Jova is under light wind shear of 5 - 10 knots, and shear is predicted to stay in the low to moderate range between now and landfall. Ocean temperatures are warm, 28 - 29°C, but the warm waters do not extend to great depth, limiting Jova's potential for rapid intensification. The upper atmosphere is also not cold enough to give Jova the kind of instability typically needed for rapid intensification. Nonetheless, both the GFDL and HWRF models predict Jova will intensify into a major Category 3 hurricane before landfall on Tuesday on the Mexican coast. The official NHC forecast is less aggressive, bringing Jova to Category 2 strength, which is probably reasonable, given the uncertainties regarding the possible interference from Hurricane Irwin to its west, and the fact that several other of our intensity models show very little strengthening. Regardless of Jova's strength at landfall, the storm will bring very heavy rains to the Mexican coast capable of causing dangerous flash floods and mudslides, beginning on Monday.

Once Jova has made landfall, Mexico needs to concern itself with Hurricane Irwin, farther to the west. Irwin will also be turned north and then northeast towards the coast of Mexico this weekend by the same trough of low pressure expected to affect Jova. The longer range computer forecast models show Irwin could make landfall as a hurricane on the Mexican coast late next week, along the same stretch of coast Jova will affect. If this verifies, the one-two punch of heavy rains from two tropical cyclones within a week could cause a devastating flood situation along the Mexican coast. However, the track forecast for Irwin has a higher degree of uncertainty than usual, and Baja is also at risk from this storm.

Jeff Masters
Categories: Hurricane
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1. Neapolitan 1:05 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Good morning, Dr. Masters.

Still sunny and dry and breezy here in Naples. It's odd to see all that moisture pinwheeling across the region with nary a drop making its way to the ground here. Yet...
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2. TampaSpin 1:09 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Thanks Dr. Masters!
Looks like nearly every model has now shifted to the West Coast of Florida and the GOM. Big shift over nite with the Consensus of models.

It appears from the Consensus of Models that the Low Pressure should develop near the NorthWestern side of Cuba. With the amount of Shear it would nearly have to be a SubTropical System one would think.
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3. SOUTHFL43YRS 1:09 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
THANKS DR. M.
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4. WeatherNerdPR 1:12 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Good Morning.
Thanks Dr. Masters.
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5. TampaSpin 1:15 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Looks like the Potential System could become a NorEaster type system for the NE also. Need to watch this very close if you live along the NE Coast.
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6. surfsidesindy 1:18 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Well, I can confirm the above for Cocoa Beach. It's been a crazy night and morning with squalls coming through and severe lightening last night. Showing 3" in my rain gauge, but a lot of the rain is being blown sideways. Definitely feels tropical and the rain is welcome. Entertaining the 10 and 13 year old indoors the next 2 days is going to be the real challenge!
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7. islander101010 1:18 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
dark outside frogs are singing e cen fl.
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8. WeatherNerdPR 1:19 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Something is wrong with this.
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9. interstatelover7165 1:19 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Thank You Dr. M. Very interesting situation we got here.
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10. indianrivguy 1:20 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Thanks Doc!

Hey Tim, got a link to a model or two?
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11. overwash12 1:27 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Looks like this will be a bad beach erosion event,given the long fetch of easterly winds!
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12. TampaSpin 1:28 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting indianrivguy:
Thanks Doc!

Hey Tim, got a link to a model or two?



Here you go!









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13. AussieStorm 1:28 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Eastern U. S. - Water Vapor

Loop

Gulf Of Mexico - Water Vapor

Loop
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14. redwagon 1:30 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting islander101010:
dark outside frogs are singing e cen fl.

This is the first dark morning in Austin in.... a year? If it does rain, the streets will be like mayonnaise with all the accumulated oil and gas.
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15. indianrivguy 1:30 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
12. TampaSpin

Thanks bro, 'preciate it!
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16. TampaSpin 1:30 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting indianrivguy:
Thanks Doc!

Hey Tim, got a link to a model or two?


Go to my blog.........i have some running there but, most on my Website which i cannot post or get banned. Sorry!
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17. LargoFl 1:30 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TampaSpin:



Here you go!









http://weather.myfoxtampabay.com/maps/WTVT/custom /models/cmc/cmc_carib_mslp_anim.gif
gee 2 of the models put it in the gulf, one has it crossing over florida towards the northeastern coast, thanks for the model runs
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18. LargoFl 1:32 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting redwagon:

This is the first dark morning in Austin in.... a year? If it does rain, the streets will be like mayonnaise with all the accumulated oil and gas.
weather channel said you may get an inch or more water out of that line of storms, i know you can sure use whatever it brings..good luck
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19. indianrivguy 1:33 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting overwash12:
Looks like this will be a bad beach erosion event,given the long fetch of easterly winds!


I was on the beach here in Jensen the day following Irene's passage and there were hundreds of sea turtle eggs rolling in the surf from the erosion.

This event will get some more. :(
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20. JrWeathermanFL 1:34 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Post 8,
No, When Phillipe curved he stayed within 5 degrees or so of latitude and longitude and was a fairly disorganized system making it appear like that.
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21. islander101010 1:40 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
nasty 30mph up heavy rain
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22. CaribBoy 1:42 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
PR ..

NO SIGNIFICANT WEATHER MAKERS FORESEEN
IN THE NEXT SEVERAL DAYS.


WTF, it has been the same for days.... if not weeks! This must end soon! What's going on where are the october rains!!!!!
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23. seflagamma 1:42 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Good morning everyone and Thanks for the Update Dr Jeff,


Well we got some rain yesterday and some thunderstorms last night...

and today is just nasty! several lines have come thur here in Broward County but it looks
like Central Florida and then north Florida will get most of the rain from this storm..


Which is good because central Florida rains flow into Lake Okeechobee and it should
finally bring that lake back up to "normal" 13-15 ft...anything over 15 ft they drain out anyway..

Hope this system and the one in Texas brings some rain relief to the drought areas.



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24. TampaSpin 1:42 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    


Could be a spin starting SE of Jamaica possibly on the last loops!
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25. CaribBoy 1:44 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting islander101010:
nasty 30mph up heavy rain


interesting to me, send me some please.. it's a desert here. not normal this time of year... MJO do something!!!
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26. overwash12 1:44 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting indianrivguy:


I was on the beach here in Jensen the day following Irene's passage and there were hundreds of sea turtle eggs rolling in the surf from the erosion.

This event will get some more. :(
In 1989,I went down to the Oceanfront during a bad nor'easter,there were thousands of starfish washed up on the beach,never seen that before or ever again. You should have collected some turtle eggs and tried to let them hatch.
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27. TropicalAnalystwx13 1:45 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting JrWeathermanFL:
Post 8,
No, When Phillipe curved he stayed within 5 degrees or so of latitude and longitude and was a fairly disorganized system making it appear like that.

It has nothing to do with Philippe being disorganized, it just shows that Philippe had a very erratic track.
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28. WeatherNerdPR 1:49 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:

It has nothing to do with Philippe being disorganized, it just shows that Philippe had a very erratic track.

And that WU screwed up and made Philippe's wind radii look like a block. lol
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29. wunderweatherman123 1:49 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:

It has nothing to do with Philippe being disorganized, it just shows that Philippe had a very erratic track.
any change on jova and irwin TA 13 :)
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30. TropicalAnalystwx13 1:52 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting wunderweatherman123:
any change on jova and irwin TA 13 :)


Jova? No. Irwin? Down to 70 kt. (80 mph).
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31. Sfloridacat5 1:55 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Looks to me that the Low is going to form down in this mess just South of Key West. Some general rotation is also seen in this mess.

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32. WeatherNerdPR 1:56 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:


Jova? No. Irwin? Down to 70 kt. (80 mph).

Irwin looks horrible. I think his center is partially exposed. Jova looks the same, just a humongous blob of strong thunderstorms.
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33. TropicalAnalystwx13 1:58 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting WeatherNerdPR:

Irwin looks horrible. I think his center is partially exposed. Jova looks the same, just a humongous blob of strong thunderstorms.

Yeah, Irwin's center is exposed. We'll see Jova better soon, when the sun rises over there.

-----

And the wind will only get stronger...

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34. TampaSpin 2:01 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
35. redwagon 2:01 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TampaSpin:


Could be a spin starting SE of Jamaica possibly on the last loops!

Look at those beautiful plumes of moisture streaming into Texas. Now if 99 would just make the jump across.. she could come straight here like Hermine did.
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36. TropicalAnalystwx13 2:02 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
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37. WeatherNerdPR 2:02 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:

Yeah, Irwin's center is exposed. We'll see Jova better soon, when the sun rises over there.

-----

And the wind will only get stronger...


Not a very pretty day for the eastern coast of the Sunshine State.
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38. WeatherNerdPR 2:04 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:

It's beautiful
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39. Skyepony (Mod) 2:04 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Made for great sleeping weather in Melbourne. I'm in the green with 1.45" so far. Pouring now. Yard was dry so it's sucking it up. Highest wind so far 20mph. Around 6am the barrier island & like Indialantic Beach has some horrid cloud to ground. It never did quite make it here but made for a show..
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40. TropicalAnalystwx13 2:04 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
This is what one type of Subtropical development looks like:

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41. TampaSpin 2:13 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    



Just off SW Florida and moving near the Florida Straits is the mostly likely Development areas. My best guess would be off SE Florida looking at everything. We could very well get a LLC spinning under the ULL low in the GOM. That would be my likely way of developing something as conditions would not be all that bad in that position. You can see the ULL below.

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42. EYEStoSEA 2:13 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
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43. redwagon 2:15 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting TropicalAnalystwx13:
This is what one type of Subtropical development looks like:


One characteristic of subtropical is that dry air doesn't impede it. Lee gobbled up dry air with gusto and strengthened.. he was deemed to be a hybrid in the end.
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44. EYEStoSEA 2:16 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
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45. TampaSpin 2:16 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
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46. reedzone 2:18 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
ZCZC MIATWOAT ALL
TTAA00 KNHC DDHHMM

TROPICAL WEATHER OUTLOOK
NWS NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
800 AM EDT SAT OCT 8 2011

FOR THE NORTH ATLANTIC...CARIBBEAN SEA AND THE GULF OF MEXICO...

THE NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER IS ISSUING ADVISORIES ON TROPICAL
STORM PHILIPPE...LOCATED ABOUT 865 MILES EAST OF BERMUDA...OR
ABOUT 1350 MILES WEST-SOUTHWEST OF THE AZORES ISLANDS.

1. A BROAD SURFACE TROUGH INTERACTING WITH AN UPPER-LEVEL LOW IS
PRODUCING WIDESPREAD CLOUDINESS AND SCATTERED THUNDERSTORMS OVER
THE NORTHWESTERN CARIBBEAN SEA AND EXTENDING NORTHWARD OVER MUCH
OF CUBA...MOST OF THE FLORIDA PENINSULA...AND ALL OF THE BAHAMAS.
GRADUAL DEVELOPMENT OF THIS LARGE AREA OF DISTURBED WEATHER IS
POSSIBLE OVER THE NEXT FEW DAYS
AS IT MOVES SLOWLY NORTHWARD OR
NORTHWESTWARD. THIS SYSTEM HAS A LOW CHANCE...20 PERCENT...OF
BECOMING A TROPICAL OR SUBTROPICAL CYCLONE DURING THE NEXT 48
HOURS. REGARDLESS OF DEVELOPMENT...THIS DISTURBANCE WILL PRODUCE
STRONG GUSTY WINDS AND LOCALLY HEAVY RAINFALL ACROSS PORTIONS OF
THE BAHAMAS AND THE FLORIDA PENINSULA OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS.

ELSEWHERE...TROPICAL CYCLONE FORMATION IS NOT EXPECTED DURING THE
NEXT 48 HOURS.

$$
FORECASTER STEWART
NNNN

NHC jumped right on it!
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47. EYEStoSEA 2:18 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
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48. Ameister12 2:19 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Good morning.

Wow! Irwin has been ripped apart.
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49. TropicalAnalystwx13 2:23 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Watch here...I know it doesn't look like much, but check out the 850 mb. vorticity map.



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50. CybrTeddy 2:24 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Will be very curious to see how this possible sub-tropical storm sets up over the coming days. The genesis will be similar to 2007's TD 10. I will also have to disagree with the doctor about it being unlikely it will develop, one has to remember sub-tropical formation is highly complex, so the models are going to be unsure of the exact scenario. All the models indicate that tomorrow morning is when we will start to begin to see genesis from this mess. It will look VERY strange though, and a lot of people will probably look at it and laugh - because it will sport limited convection over its circulation and have all the convection spread out to the north of the low.. by then I imagine it would be 93L. If it develops, Monday would be my best guess. But you can tell though by this satellite image, something is up.
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51. TropicalAnalystwx13 2:27 PM GMT en Octubre 08, 2011    
Quoting CybrTeddy:
Will be very curious to see how this possible sub-tropical storm sets up over the coming days. The genesis will be similar to 2007's TD 10. I will also have to disagree with the doctor about it being unlikely it will develop, one has to remember sub-tropical formation is highly complex, so the models are going to be unsure of the exact scenario. All the models indicate that tomorrow morning is when we will start to begin to see genesis from this mess. It will look VERY strange though, and a lot of people will probably look at it and laugh - because it will sport limited convection over its circulation and have all the convection spread out to the north of the low.. by then I imagine it would be 93L. If it develops, Monday would be my best guess. But you can tell though by this satellite image, something is up.

I agree.
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About JeffMasters
Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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