Dr. Jeff Masters' WunderBlog

Disturbance 90L close to tropical depression strength; TD 2 may rise again
Posted by: Dr. Jeff Masters, 2:02 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009 +4
A strong tropical wave (90L), with a large circulation and a moderate amount of heavy thunderstorm activity, is a few hundred miles southwest of the Cape Verdes Islands, off the coast of Africa. This morning's QuikSCAT pass shows that 90L has a large circulation, but this circulation is not yet well-formed, as it is elongated along an east-west axis. Satellite imagery from the European METEOSAT satellite show that the heavy thunderstorms associated with 90L are gradually becoming better organized, with some spiral banding evident on the south side of the storm. Satellite intensity estimates from NOAA already put 90L at tropical depression strength with 30 mph winds, but the storm does not yet have a well enough formed circulation to be classified as a depression. Water vapor imagery shows that since 90L is forming several hundred miles south of the dry air of the Saharan Air Layer (SAL), the storm should not be affected by dry air and dust as much as Tropical Depression Two was. However, there is some dry air from the SAL being sucked into the circulation of 90L, and this is retarding its development.

Wind shear is moderate, about 10 - 15 knots, but is forecast to fall to the low range, 5 - 10 knots, later today. Shear is then forecast to remain low for the next five days. Sea Surface Temperatures are about 28°C, and will remain in the 27 - 28°C range the next five days. The combination of low wind shear and sufficiently warm SSTs should allow 90L to develop into a tropical depression by Saturday, and potentially reach hurricane strength by Wednesday. Most of our reliable models strengthen 90L into a hurricane by Wednesday, when the storm is expected to be near the northern Lesser Antilles Islands. One important outlier is the ECMWF model, which has 90L passing to the north of the islands, and eventually recurving out to sea east of Bermuda. The ECMWF was by far the most reliable model for forecasting hurricane tracks last year. However, all of our models are pretty unreliable going out 5 days in advance for systems that have yet to reach tropical depression strength. Once 90L becomes a tropical depression and develops a well-formed circulation, the models will have a better handle on forecasting where it will go.


Figure 1. The remnants of Tropical Depression Two (left side of image) and tropical wave 90L (right side of image).

Tropical Depression Two may come back
Tropical Depression Two died yesterday, but may rise again. Satellite loops of the remnants of the storm show that heavy thunderstorms are again attempting a comeback near the axis of what is now a tropical wave. However, dry air continues to interfere with the development of the thunderstorm activity, and moderately high wind shear of 15 - 20 knots is also inhibiting the process. Wind shear over the remnants of TD 2 is expected to remain in the moderate range, 10 - 20 knots, over the next four days. Sea Surface Temperatures (SSTs) are 27°C, but will warm to 28°C two days from now. There is plenty of dry, stable air from the Saharan Air Layer (SAL) to the north and west that will continue to cause the storm problems. The relatively cool SSTs and dry air mean that any re-development of the storm will be slow to occur. NHC has given the system a medium (30 - 50% chance) of becoming a tropical depression again by Sunday morning. Only one reliable model, the NOGAPS, is predicting regeneration of TD 2. The NOAA Hurricane Hunters are flying research missions into the remnants of TD 2 today and Saturday.

I'll have an update Saturday morning, or earlier, if significant developments occur.

Jeff Masters
Categories: Hurricane
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1751. Chiggy007 10:36 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Anyone see the center of 90L around 11.5N - 29.5W! To my eyes it's pretty evident...
1752. Patrap 10:36 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Member Since: Julio 3, 2005 Posts: 372 Comments: 111641
1753. SavannahStorm 10:37 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting jaxairportman:
Here is a new poll how many here think it has become a dictatorship?


Who's the dictator?

It's more like an oligarchy...
Member Since: Septiembre 22, 2005 Posts: 18 Comments: 2135
1756. weatherboykris 10:38 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
.
Member Since: Diciembre 9, 2006 Posts: 125 Comments: 11343
1757. Camellia1356 10:39 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting jaxairportman:
Here is a new poll how many here think it has become a dictatorship?


Show me a big boat filled with frankfurter-shaped potatoes and...

Anyway, no, it's democratic here. Use the blog tools and everything will be A-OK.
1758. Drakoen 10:39 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Chiggy007:
Anyone see the center of 90L around 11.5N - 29.5W! To my eyes it's pretty evident...


Not even close
Member Since: Octubre 28, 2006 Posts: 57 Comments: 29010
1761. seflagamma 10:40 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting DestinJeff:
Would like to comment that the current tone on the blog is great. Not over-dramatic, not tit-for-tat ... just a bunch of tropic-geeks doing their thing.

While many people are yet unaware, those here have at least an understanding of what the next several days might entail.

Keep of the good work fellas and ladies.


I noticed this also today. Very nice , very nice; hope this keeps up when it gets even more "exciting" around here!

Good job everyone; lurking today has been pleasant.
Member Since: Agosto 29, 2005 Posts: 286 Comments: 40485
1762. nrtiwlnvragn 10:40 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Member Since: Septiembre 23, 2005 Posts: 11 Comments: 8946
1763. WPBHurricane05 10:40 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Patrap:





True Patrap. We are no where close to the horrors of Hitler and Stalin.
Member Since: Julio 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 7930
1764. chevycanes 10:41 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
goes just south of S. FL on this run of the GFS and hits New Orleans.
Member Since: Agosto 6, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 687
1765. weatherboykris 10:41 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
.
Member Since: Diciembre 9, 2006 Posts: 125 Comments: 11343
1766. Patrap 10:41 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Member Since: Julio 3, 2005 Posts: 372 Comments: 111641
1768. DDR 10:41 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Patrap:




What does this have to do with weather?
I putting you back where you belong,my S**t list.
Member Since: Abril 27, 2007 Posts: 13 Comments: 1476
1769. IKE 10:41 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting weatherboykris:
18z GFS takes it through Miami area...remember, this far out exact track doesn't really matter.

http://www.nco.ncep.noaa.gov/pmb/nwprod/analysis/namer/gfs/12/images/gfs_ten_204l.gif


Put them shutters up WS!
Member Since: Junio 9, 2005 Posts: 23 Comments: 37047
1770. adjusterx 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting jaxairportman:
Here is a new poll how many here think it has become a dictatorship?


No dictorama here, just be ready to back what you type.It's better to let the info guys battle(which they usually end up agreeing at the end) then to jump in the middle of it.
1771. Thundercloud01221991 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
yea but I have seen them keep a system up for 2-3 days w/o any convection just to have it come back and become a hurricane
Member Since: Agosto 1, 2006 Posts: 28 Comments: 3673
1772. Ldog74 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Kinda surprised that I'm not hearing any "OMG Td 2 is going to regenerate in the Bahamas and be Katrina's big sister!!", but thats a welcome subtraction to this blog.

90L needs to get smaller, if it could shed some of its weight it'd make it a lot easier to wind up.

And for the possibility that 90L is going to rapidly intensify, i doubt it. At least over the next couple of days. Rapid intensification, being a technical term of a decrease of 42 millibars in less than 24 hours, has a low chance of occurring in such cool (relatively speaking) waters. Not to mention that currently 90L is much too large of a system for a "normal" rapid intensification situation to occur. As for when its closer to the East Coast/Caribbean, sure, it could happen.
Member Since: Junio 11, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 165
1773. stormwatcherCI 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Drakoen:


Not even close
Looks more like 12.5 and 30.0 to me.
Member Since: Octubre 9, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 8043
1774. Dropsonde 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting weatherboykris:
18z GFS takes it through Miami area...remember, this far out exact track doesn't really matter.

http://www.nco.ncep.noaa.gov/pmb/nwprod/analysis/namer/gfs/12/images/gfs_ten_204l.gif
That is the 12Z. The 18Z is another Gulf storm, the third out of today's four runs. :(
Member Since: Agosto 22, 2006 Posts: 10 Comments: 414
1775. extreme236 10:42 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting WeatherStudent:


Yup, eleven counts of the GFS taking the storm to Florida. More to follow suite. A trend? clearly.


Its not even a TD yet. Far as you know five days from now they will be pointed elsewhere.
Member Since: Agosto 2, 2007 Posts: 19 Comments: 19234
1777. Patrap 10:43 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting DDR:

What does this have to do with weather?
I putting you back where you belong,my S**t list.



Im hurt,really hurt,..man...a lil humor and the Place goes up In A Glenn Beck Moment

LOL
Member Since: Julio 3, 2005 Posts: 372 Comments: 111641
1778. extreme236 10:44 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Ldog74:
Kinda surprised that I'm not hearing any "OMG Td 2 is going to regenerate in the Bahamas and be Katrina's big sister!!", but thats a welcome subtraction to this blog.

90L needs to get smaller, if it could shed some of its weight it'd make it a lot easier to wind up.

And for the possibility that 90L is going to rapidly intensify, i doubt it. At least over the next couple of days. Rapid intensification, being a technical term of a decrease of 42 millibars in less than 24 hours, has a low chance of occurring in such cool (relatively speaking) waters. Not to mention that currently 90L is much too large of a system for a "normal" rapid intensification situation to occur. As for when its closer to the East Coast/Caribbean, sure, it could happen.


SHIPs RI index for 25kt increase in 24 hours suggests only a 30% chance for rapid intensification.
Member Since: Agosto 2, 2007 Posts: 19 Comments: 19234
1780. adjusterx 10:44 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Patrap:



Im hurt,really hurt,..man...a lil humor and the Place goes up In A Glenn Beck Moment

LOL


Was that directed at you?
1781. FloridaDweller 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Wow Patrap! That was really uncalled for.
Member Since: Agosto 13, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 38
1782. chevycanes 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Dropsonde:
That is the 12Z. The 18Z is another Gulf storm, the third out of today's four runs. :(

all the runs also take it very close or over S. FL.

it can very easily hit both.
Member Since: Agosto 6, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 687
1783. Dropsonde 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
I am getting really tired of seeing things like this:

http://www.nco.ncep.noaa.gov/pmb/nwprod/analysis/carib/gfs/18/images/gfs_ten_252l.gif

At this point I'm definitely rooting for the Euro solution.
Member Since: Agosto 22, 2006 Posts: 10 Comments: 414
1784. weatherboykris 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Patrap:



Im hurt,really hurt,..man...a lil humor and the Place goes up In A Glenn Beck Moment

LOL


LMAO...that made me laugh.
Member Since: Diciembre 9, 2006 Posts: 125 Comments: 11343
1785. Tazmanian 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting jasoniscoolman10:







Aug. 14, 2009 6:18 pm ET
A juicy but fading front coupled with a tropical disturbance coming out of the Bahamas and Hispaniola with trigger thunderstorms from the Carolinas to the northern Gulf Coast states this weekend. Some of the thunderstorms will contain flash flooding rains.with all his rain from FL TO NC if a big hurricane hit land there will be lots of tree coming down.






why are you posting weather maps from TWC that is called Copyrighting
Member Since: Mayo 21, 2006 Posts: 5088 Comments: 111361
1787. jipmg 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting RainyEyes:
I don't know if that is a pinhole Taz, but look at the beautiful tails (don't know the technical term...I am new) That looks like one of those perfect little symbols that the weather stations use and put on top of a hurricane. The blender blade look. Awesome view!


feeder bands
1788. Seflhurricane 10:45 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
max mayfield seemed a bit uptiet this evening i think those disturbances are starting to worry him a little bit
Member Since: Julio 14, 2009 Posts: 0 Comments: 2898
1789. extreme236 10:46 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting DDR:

What does this have to do with weather?
I putting you back where you belong,my S**t list.


What does your post have to do with weather?
Member Since: Agosto 2, 2007 Posts: 19 Comments: 19234
1791. weatherboykris 10:47 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
OMG...everyone lay off Patrap...he posted a pic of Nazis...big deal.
Member Since: Diciembre 9, 2006 Posts: 125 Comments: 11343
1792. louisianaboy444 10:47 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
JFV actually the GFS model takes it to the straits
Member Since: Agosto 29, 2006 Posts: 17 Comments: 1219
1793. FloridaTigers 10:47 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
WS, do you want S. Fla to get hit by a hurricane? Just curious.
Member Since: Mayo 17, 2009 Posts: 0 Comments: 559
1794. Chiggy007 10:47 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Well, then 90L has more than one LLC competing.. I clearly see "one of the LLCs" around 11.5N - 30W in the NHC sat loops...
1795. CaneWarning 10:49 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting SavannahStorm:




I am coming for you, Pat, and your fascist buddies.



Ew.
Member Since: Abril 26, 2009 Posts: 3 Comments: 3667
1796. chevycanes 10:47 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Quoting Seflhurricane:
max mayfield seemed a bit uptiet this evening i think those disturbances are starting to worry him a little bit

he prolly see's what the models are doing and see's how the steering currents are setting up.
Member Since: Agosto 6, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 687
1800. Chiggy007 10:48 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
18Z GFDL is even further SOUTH now...
1801. jipmg 10:48 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009    
Convection continues to wrap around the center of 90L, TD 2 might be reinstated soon

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About JeffMasters
Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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