Dr. Jeff Masters' WunderBlog

Disturbance 90L close to tropical depression strength; TD 2 may rise again
Posted by: Dr. Jeff Masters, 2:02 PM GMT en Agosto 14, 2009 +4
A strong tropical wave (90L), with a large circulation and a moderate amount of heavy thunderstorm activity, is a few hundred miles southwest of the Cape Verdes Islands, off the coast of Africa. This morning's QuikSCAT pass shows that 90L has a large circulation, but this circulation is not yet well-formed, as it is elongated along an east-west axis. Satellite imagery from the European METEOSAT satellite show that the heavy thunderstorms associated with 90L are gradually becoming better organized, with some spiral banding evident on the south side of the storm. Satellite intensity estimates from NOAA already put 90L at tropical depression strength with 30 mph winds, but the storm does not yet have a well enough formed circulation to be classified as a depression. Water vapor imagery shows that since 90L is forming several hundred miles south of the dry air of the Saharan Air Layer (SAL), the storm should not be affected by dry air and dust as much as Tropical Depression Two was. However, there is some dry air from the SAL being sucked into the circulation of 90L, and this is retarding its development.

Wind shear is moderate, about 10 - 15 knots, but is forecast to fall to the low range, 5 - 10 knots, later today. Shear is then forecast to remain low for the next five days. Sea Surface Temperatures are about 28°C, and will remain in the 27 - 28°C range the next five days. The combination of low wind shear and sufficiently warm SSTs should allow 90L to develop into a tropical depression by Saturday, and potentially reach hurricane strength by Wednesday. Most of our reliable models strengthen 90L into a hurricane by Wednesday, when the storm is expected to be near the northern Lesser Antilles Islands. One important outlier is the ECMWF model, which has 90L passing to the north of the islands, and eventually recurving out to sea east of Bermuda. The ECMWF was by far the most reliable model for forecasting hurricane tracks last year. However, all of our models are pretty unreliable going out 5 days in advance for systems that have yet to reach tropical depression strength. Once 90L becomes a tropical depression and develops a well-formed circulation, the models will have a better handle on forecasting where it will go.


Figure 1. The remnants of Tropical Depression Two (left side of image) and tropical wave 90L (right side of image).

Tropical Depression Two may come back
Tropical Depression Two died yesterday, but may rise again. Satellite loops of the remnants of the storm show that heavy thunderstorms are again attempting a comeback near the axis of what is now a tropical wave. However, dry air continues to interfere with the development of the thunderstorm activity, and moderately high wind shear of 15 - 20 knots is also inhibiting the process. Wind shear over the remnants of TD 2 is expected to remain in the moderate range, 10 - 20 knots, over the next four days. Sea Surface Temperatures (SSTs) are 27°C, but will warm to 28°C two days from now. There is plenty of dry, stable air from the Saharan Air Layer (SAL) to the north and west that will continue to cause the storm problems. The relatively cool SSTs and dry air mean that any re-development of the storm will be slow to occur. NHC has given the system a medium (30 - 50% chance) of becoming a tropical depression again by Sunday morning. Only one reliable model, the NOGAPS, is predicting regeneration of TD 2. The NOAA Hurricane Hunters are flying research missions into the remnants of TD 2 today and Saturday.

I'll have an update Saturday morning, or earlier, if significant developments occur.

Jeff Masters
Categories: Hurricane
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5501. jipmg 3:42 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting P451:




interesting.. there is a definate counter clock wise spin on the radar, possibly at the surface too.. very breezy over miami right now
5502. weatherfan92 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting sfla82:


I agree! Everyone keeps saying S Fla...Nope!!! Its the GOM's storm!


I agree. If Ana hits S. FL, it should still move into the Gulf to reorganize.
5503. centex 3:43 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
These things going W longer than models showing. They have proven this year that they are poor predictors with developing systems.
Member Since: Agosto 10, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 2876
5504. jipmg 3:43 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting stoormfury:
TD3 is moving south of west, which will make that turn projected turn by the NHC even way off target. the longer it takes for the system to move north the more threatening it becomes for the central winward islands. i will not be surprise if the track is shifted to the left in the next advisory


The forecast was for it to move WSW for a while.. then curve WNW, dont think this sudden WSW movement is strange at all
5505. canesrule1 3:43 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting jipmg:


interesting.. there is a definate counter clock wise spin on the radar, possibly at the surface too.. very breezy over miami right now
yup
5506. Chiggy007 3:43 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
What if TD reaches 10N - realistic scenario since NHC surface maps has it moving WSW quite a while...
5507. AussieStorm 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting WeatherStudent:



Adrian, both of these features are gonna fizzle out and that's final. Very A typical of an El Nino Hurricane Season.

Do you have proof of this comment or you been taking the wrong medicine again list the other morning?
Member Since: Septiembre 30, 2007 Posts: 5 Comments: 13795
5508. Melagoo 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting HurricaneKyle:


exactly.. ???
People that are calling out TD3 don't know what they are talking about in my opinion. This thing has the potential to become a serious threat.


Does the term MONSTER mean anything ... It looks very powerful already!
Member Since: Julio 31, 2006 Posts: 19 Comments: 1512
5509. HurricaneKyle 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting sfla82:


Yeah which we all knew was going to happen!!!! They always curve away!


uhh.. huh? Your joking right?

Seems like some people think El Nino is an absolute guarantee that they are safe and that everything will either poof or curve out to see. Which as you can ask 23 this too, its totally untrue.
Member Since: Agosto 10, 2009 Posts: 3 Comments: 672
5510. stoormfury 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Steve Lyons on the recent tropicalmupdate said that ANA would reach south Florida as a 70 mph storm in seven days time
Member Since: Agosto 22, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 2320
5511. drg0dOwnCountry 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting KBH:

Is it possible that these three systems will be interacting with each other, for better or worst..
I am guessing where one goes the others will follow.
and the add one more system to the fray, look behind the wave exiting Africa, another system in a few days

Those system seem to feed each other. as of now not so much, but there is clearly a visible counter mirror circulation going on. And in such process i belive the stronger one gains more. Which might influence storm speed and the rise of the chance to absorb even more.
Also the pattern suggest that these circulating patterns improve each other, hence increase the conditions for incoming systems.

For our scenario rightnow it would require substantial slowing or temporary stalling of 1 system.
It will be intresting to see this in the coming days when a storm interacts with land or higher SST.
Member Since: Septiembre 22, 2005 Posts: 11 Comments: 1957
5512. CJ5 3:44 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
There seems to be some good agreement (albiet long term) on Ana going Miami or S and TD3 going Miami or N. Then there is the african wave behind TD3...could be a long few weeks.

Link
Member Since: Julio 4, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 1711
5513. all4hurricanes 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Last retired B hurricane was Bob 1991
hopefully Bill won't be as bad
Member Since: Marzo 29, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 2235
5514. centex 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
The reason models show W or WSW in short term is because that is what it's currently doing. Not really a forecast track.
Member Since: Agosto 10, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 2876
5515. TexasHurricane 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
yeah, that GOM water is saying come to momma.....
Member Since: Julio 2, 2009 Posts: 0 Comments: 2811
5516. canesrule1 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting AussieStorm:

Do you have proof of this comment or you been taking the wrong medicine again list the other morning?
roflmao
5517. Hurricane4Lex 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting Chiggy007:
What if TD reaches 10N - realistic scenario since NHC surface maps has it moving WSW quite a while...


It becomes a "sudden death match" to move more north?
Member Since: Agosto 14, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 657
5518. extreme236 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
12Z GFS 12 hours...showing that new African system:



Member Since: Agosto 2, 2007 Posts: 19 Comments: 19234
5519. WPBHurricane05 3:45 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
To bad its not a typical El Nino...its a reactive one.
Member Since: Julio 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 8005
5521. Nolehead 3:46 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
AussieStorm 3:44 PM GMT on August 15, 2009
Quoting WeatherStudent:



Adrian, both of these features are gonna fizzle out and that's final. Very A typical of an El Nino Hurricane Season.

Do you have proof of this comment or you been taking the wrong medicine again list the other morning?



is there a Dr. in the house??
Member Since: Junio 3, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 1919
5522. LPStormspotter 3:46 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
OMG!!! log off at 1am still the same ole thing.. Just got back on and WOW.. How the H E double hockey sticks did 3 get in there?
Member Since: Julio 17, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 378
5523. InTheCone 3:46 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting all4hurricanes:

I think the tip of cuba or even Cozumel would be the Hurricane Capital


According to what I read on Hurricane City a few years ago Grand Cayman is hit the most by tropical systems in the Atlantic basin. They did go into the Pacific.
Member Since: Septiembre 1, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 1979
5524. stormwatcherCI 3:46 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting AussieStorm:

Do you have proof of this comment or you been taking the wrong medicine again list the other morning?
Isn't his opinion good enough ? LOL
Member Since: Octubre 9, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 8063
5525. cchsweatherman 3:46 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Member Since: Abril 14, 2007 Posts: 8 Comments: 4928
5526. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting WeatherStudent:



Adrian, both of these features are gonna fizzle out and that's final. Very A typical of an El Nino Hurricane Season.
you are the only thing that may fizzle out

don't take your eye off the ball or it could smack you in the face
Member Since: Julio 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41332
5527. CybrTeddy 3:49 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Afternoon everyone! Seems we got some people here writing off Ana and calling TD3 a fish (JFV as usual of course.) Remember Ana is a fighter, its going to be hard to kill it off. TD3 is pretty down south too, it is going to be hard for that to curve out to see without threatening the islands.
Member Since: Julio 8, 2005 Posts: 255 Comments: 20650
5528. LightningCharmer 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
West shifting winds in Florida Keys system. Perhaps a surface low has formed.

Conditions at SANF1 as of
(11:00 am EDT)
1500 GMT on 08/15/2009:

Continuous Winds TIME
(EDT) WDIR WSPD
11:00 am SW ( 227 deg ) 23 kts
10:50 am SSW ( 195 deg ) 26 kts
10:40 am S ( 178 deg ) 25 kts
10:30 am SSE ( 164 deg ) 25 kts
10:20 am SSE ( 155 deg ) 21 kts
10:10 am SE ( 145 deg ) 18 kts

Station SANF1 - Sand Key, FL

NWS Long Range Reflectivity Key West, FL
Member Since: Septiembre 1, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 1111
5529. farhaonhebrew 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting sopla2o:


Is that even possible, that TD3 takes over Ana...


evrything is possible, but in this case is not likely due to thes systems a very apart each other and ana is increasing it speed..
Member Since: Julio 14, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 235
5530. canesrule1 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting HurricaneKyle:


uhh.. huh? Your joking right?

Seems like some people think El Nino is an absolute guarantee that they are safe and that everything will either poof or curve out to see. Which as you can ask 23 this too, its totally untrue.
how bout andrew that was en el nino year?
5531. seflagamma 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Good morning again,

been reading back on some posts..

folks.. no one is "a target or not a target" at this point. be real... for the next 5 days those models will change every 3 hours.

it will sway way to the north and south so many times over the next few days you all will make yourself nuts.

These systems will strengthen and weaken and die and come back etc. This is an El Nino year so lots of shear out there to blow the tops off these systems.

It is fun, but don't be making Declarations about it hitting or not hitting your area.

Best place to be 3-4 days out is in the center of the cone, because then it is for sure it will not hit your area. LOL just kidding.. that is a joke not a statement! :o)


Member Since: Agosto 29, 2005 Posts: 287 Comments: 40512
5532. wantsnow 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
5500....Do I here 6000???
Member Since: Diciembre 8, 2005 Posts: 0 Comments: 17
5533. CJ5 3:47 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting WeatherStudent:



Adrian, both of these features are gonna fizzle out and that's final. Very A typical of an El Nino Hurricane Season.


Come on, Dude. There is a big difference in educated speculation and plain old misinformation. The later can be very dangerous.
Member Since: Julio 4, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 1711
5534. AussieStorm 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting Nolehead:
AussieStorm 3:44 PM GMT on August 15, 2009
Quoting WeatherStudent:



Adrian, both of these features are gonna fizzle out and that's final. Very A typical of an El Nino Hurricane Season.

Do you have proof of this comment or you been taking the wrong medicine again list the other morning?



is there a Dr. in the house??

Send the doctor over to WeatherStudent's place, check if his brain and hands are connected and functioning properly, sorry mate,,, your Ignored Name #11
Member Since: Septiembre 30, 2007 Posts: 5 Comments: 13795
5535. seflagamma 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
I hope Dr Master's gets here with a new blog soon.
Member Since: Agosto 29, 2005 Posts: 287 Comments: 40512
5536. HurrikanEB 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
90Knots in 120 hours...TD3 is going to be a mean one...and the nhc has it taking pretty much the sane course as ANA, for now. Gonna be an interesting week.
Member Since: Mayo 2, 2008 Posts: 12 Comments: 1273
5538. stormwatcherCI 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting InTheCone:


According to what I read on Hurricane City a few years ago Grand Cayman is hit the most by tropical systems in the Atlantic basin. They did go into the Pacific.
I don't think Grand Cayman is "hit" the most but quite a few very close encounters.
Member Since: Octubre 9, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 8063
5539. PensacolaDoug 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting stoormfury:
Steve Lyons on the recent tropicalmupdate said that ANA would reach south Florida as a 70 mph storm in seven days time



Well, I guess we can mail out the warnings then.
Member Since: Julio 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 4831
5540. jipmg 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Ana starting to move just north of due west, very exposed though
5541. WPBHurricane05 3:48 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting cchsweatherman:


Good perspective. Was gonna post something like that but yours is better.
Member Since: Julio 31, 2006 Posts: 56 Comments: 8005
5542. ftpiercecane 3:49 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting KEEPEROFTHEGATE:
you are the only thing that may fizzle out

don't take your eye off the ball or it could smack you in the face


Thats a pretty good one KOG.
Member Since: Octubre 9, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 204
5544. VAbeachhurricanes 3:50 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    



Member Since: Septiembre 6, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 4883
5545. gbTracker 3:50 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Question: Doesn't the MJO have something to do with the pop up of three features we're watching right now.
Member Since: Julio 18, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 24
5546. hurricane23 3:52 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting futuremet:


Shear is effecting this system (10-20kts) from the base of an upper level low, not dry air. It has been like this ever since Ana formed. Dry air intrusion is not too evident.
Quoting futuremet:


Shear is effecting this system (10-20kts) from the base of an upper level low, not dry air. It has been like this ever since Ana formed. Dry air intrusion is not too evident.


?? you can clearly see its ingested some dry air as there are is no CU.Dry air is also disrupting its inflow to its southwest .
Member Since: Mayo 14, 2006 Posts: 8 Comments: 13329
5547. ftpiercecane 3:51 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Any sign of stormw this morning?
Member Since: Octubre 9, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 204
5548. Hurricane4Lex 3:51 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting jasoniscoolman10:
WHAT IS THIS NEXT TO KEY WEST..I DO NOT LIKE THIS AT ALL.


That my friend is a soon to be Humberto like cousin
Member Since: Agosto 14, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 657
5549. serialteg 3:51 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Quoting seflagamma:
Good morning again,

been reading back on some posts..

folks.. no one is "a target or not a target" at this point. be real... for the next 5 days those models will change every 3 hours.

it will sway way to the north and south so many times over the next few days you all will make yourself nuts.

These systems will strengthen and weaken and die and come back etc. This is an El Nino year so lots of shear out there to blow the tops off these systems.

It is fun, but don't be making Declarations about it hitting or not hitting your area.

Best place to be 3-4 days out is in the center of the cone, because then it is for sure it will not hit your area. LOL




knock yourself out, nice try tho ...

:)
Member Since: Agosto 22, 2006 Posts: 2 Comments: 1967
5550. 7544 3:52 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
wow td3 looks like a hurricane symbol in the visable
Member Since: Mayo 6, 2007 Posts: 0 Comments: 6023
5551. extreme236 3:52 PM GMT en Agosto 15, 2009    
Uh Ah-nah, Bill doesn't find those outflow boundaries very attractive.
Member Since: Agosto 2, 2007 Posts: 19 Comments: 19234

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About JeffMasters
Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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